Episode 2215 notes

Founded in 2024, BrokersBloc is dedicated to helping independent group benefits brokers.



Founder Stephen Combs and his VP of Sales, Marc Wiersma are here with some amazing tools and the knowledge to lower costs and bring better plans that save clients up to 20% compared to BUCA carrier plans.

Learn more, visit: https://brokersbloc.com/

This is Season 22, Episode 15 of America's Healthcare Advocate. I'm Cary Hall.

https://www.americashealthcareadvocate.com/sponsors

Have a question for me: https://www.americashealthcareadvocate.com/contact-us

As always, if you need help or have something to share, contact me using this form on my website and let me know what's on your mind, the issues you are dealing with, or any other health, healthcare, or health insurance questions or concerns. Visit: https://www.americashealthcareadvocate.com/contact-us

Episode 2215 Transcript:

00;00;00;03 - 00;00;15;18

Cary Hall

Coming up on today's show, I have two guests in studio Marc Wiersma and Stephen Combs, the founder and CEO of BrokersBloc. You want to learn how to do a better job. You want to learn how to be a better broker or if you are an employer, find solutions maybe you're not seeing. This is the show you want to listen to.

00;00;15;21 - 00;00;42;07

Cary Hall

Coming up today, our guests from BrokersBloc and now America's Healthcare Advocate, Cary Hall. Hello, America. Welcome to America's Healthcare Advocates show broadcasting Coast to coast across the USA. Here on the HIA radio Network. You can find out more about us by going to our website. AmericasHealthcareAdvocate.com. Also, all these shows are up on 16 podcast platforms and our YouTube channel.

00;00;42;09 - 00;01;02;28

Cary Hall

By the way, we're up to 653,000 views. Thanks to all of you out there in the audience and all of you listening across the country to our 243 affiliates. We appreciate all of you on terrestrial radio. Joining me in studio today Stephen Combs and Marc Wiersma. They are here from BrokersBloc. Welcome back. Thank you. You get to be a pro at this now.

00;01;02;28 - 00;01;04;24

Cary Hall

So you've done this 2 or 3 times now.

00;01;04;24 - 00;01;06;12

Stephan Combs

So yeah I was look forward to it.

00;01;06;12 - 00;01;30;28

Cary Hall

Yeah. So why don't we just start off by a little bit about you know, what you're doing. Your BrokersBloc. I mean you guys are constantly changing and improving and adding different opportunities. But it's not just for brokers. This is information that you're sharing out there for employers that you know could make a big difference. We did a workshop here a couple of weeks ago with a with a group of, folks, and they were individual brokers.

00;01;30;28 - 00;01;48;13

Cary Hall

It didn't write group health. And so what do we do? We get this group. We don't know what to do with it. So let's talk a little bit about, how if a, if an employer's not happy and, and where can they reach out, can they get help and and just overall what is it you guys have done in the marketplace now even.

00;01;48;14 - 00;02;10;04

Stephan Combs

Absolutely. So we we vet our insurance carriers very heavily, but we also inadvertently vet our brokers as well. We don't work with just anybody. So our broker partners are the best in the market. So what we're actually doing is creating a broker directory so that if a group needs to shop their broker along with their health plan, we've already done all the homework for them.

00;02;10;04 - 00;02;18;16

Stephan Combs

So we just need to ask a few questions about what it is. Their needs are, what they're looking for, and we can place them with a very high quality local broker for them.

00;02;18;18 - 00;02;42;05

Cary Hall

And that's important because they don't want it. When you're not in this business, how do you know? Okay, you know, when you're the employer, you're the human resource director. You're the ones responsible for finding you. Look, we're really happy with this guy or gal we've got. They're not doing the job. It's funny because that's exactly what I heard when I was doing this lunch and learning that we did a couple of weeks ago on gig care.

00;02;42;08 - 00;02;52;15

Cary Hall

And these these were all people that wrote an individual they didn't want to do group, but they were getting calls from people saying there are employers unhappy with the group. Where did they go? And they did not know where to go?

00;02;52;17 - 00;03;08;01

Stephan Combs

I mean, it's hard. Even if you do a Google Google search, it's hard to find where brokers are even at. You know, it's hard to find what they do. You know, and you can ask them a couple of questions. But at the end of the day, you know, everyone's going to say we have the best customer service, we have the lowest prices.

00;03;08;01 - 00;03;09;17

Stephan Combs

But you know.

00;03;09;20 - 00;03;12;26

Cary Hall

It's not it's not always about the lowest prices, Stephen. You know that.

00;03;12;27 - 00;03;13;25

Stephan Combs

Exactly okay.

00;03;13;25 - 00;03;23;02

Cary Hall

It's about benefits and pricing. And if you leave that benefits portion out and all you're doing is shopping pricing, you're probably going to do something. It's not going to work out all that well for you.

00;03;23;03 - 00;03;34;23

Stephan Combs

Oh, exactly. Exactly. That's why you have to have quality benefits that are affordable. Right. But you're right, the price should not be the leading indicator. Of course you want to be competitive, but the benefits have to be quality as well.

00;03;34;26 - 00;03;52;21

Cary Hall

Yeah they do, and that's the responsibility of the broker to do just that. And then so then the employer asks the question, well, how do I know? I went out and found this guy on Google or LinkedIn or wherever the case may be. And, and and they sound good, but how do I really know what you're doing basically is taking the guesswork out of that.

00;03;52;23 - 00;04;08;22

Stephan Combs

Exactly. We only have experience with these brokers in the business. They've written with us. And look, our broker partners have carriers that we don't represent, and that's totally fine. We're not breaking them in saying, hey, you have this, write this with us, you know, shop all your markets. And if there's a better fit outside of us, I recommend that you do that.

00;04;08;25 - 00;04;19;10

Stephan Combs

But we're here to, to help the employers find those quality brokers that will look at all the options, dig underneath every single rock, and make sure that, you know, no stone is left unturned for them.

00;04;19;12 - 00;04;41;29

Cary Hall

Yeah. And try to match up somebody that's going to understand their needs, whether it's a ten life group or a 100 life group or a thousand life group, you know, you're looking for. Those are all different categories. So you're looking to find a broker who really maybe it's Bernie that does the you know, all they do is small group and they're really good at 1 to 25 or 1 to 50.

00;04;42;02 - 00;05;03;17

Cary Hall

Now you switch gears and you go to somebody who's got 100 lives or 200 as well, or have you looked at self-funded? And oftentimes the employer goes, well, what does that mean? I don't know if I want to do that. That's scary. But if you have the right broker, talk about how that can make a difference. And they understand what knowledge is critical to making a decision if they don't have the knowledge you can't make good decisions.

00;05;03;17 - 00;05;04;00

Cary Hall

Stephen.

00;05;04;05 - 00;05;22;29

Stephan Combs

Oh, I completely agree. And that's why our brokers I mean they they vary greatly. We have brokers that are really boutique small group brokers. Smaller shops, but do wonderful work. And we have a handful of national brokers they can handle, you know, any account that you can imagine. And you're absolutely right is, you know, if it's a group that's self-funding makes a lot of sense.

00;05;22;29 - 00;05;36;24

Stephan Combs

You want to make sure, have a broker that really knows what you need. Because self-funding and level funding is a great way to control costs. But you have to understand the nuance, the compliance and make sure that, you know, going into it what it is that you're purchasing here.

00;05;36;25 - 00;05;38;03

Cary Hall

You also have to know the risk.

00;05;38;03 - 00;05;38;13

Stephan Combs

Yes.

00;05;38;19 - 00;05;46;02

Cary Hall

You know, level fund. It sounds really good for the first couple of years. And then that bag claims you're. And what do you do. Yep. Okay. And you had to have a broker that understands that.

00;05;46;09 - 00;06;07;16

Stephan Combs

Not only that but understands the different contracts. Right. There's so many different contracts out there with the actual like run out. Right. Making sure that you have enough run out or the administrative fees built in. Is my claims fund being funded properly? A lot of these carriers out there, they underfund the claims basket dramatically so that the group never gets a surplus, and then they can justify a 20% increase year after year.

00;06;07;16 - 00;06;15;15

Stephan Combs

So you're basically fully insured at that point. So making sure that the contract benefits the employer, not just year one a year two, three, four and five.

00;06;15;17 - 00;06;35;03

Cary Hall

Well, that's and that's got a lot to do with the broker. Yes. And the character of the broker okay. Because if the brokers selling we talked about this they're selling price okay. And they're promising you on level paying. Oh the surplus is going to go back to you. It's going to apply to next year. But in reality that's not going to happen.

00;06;35;05 - 00;06;36;03

Cary Hall

They should know that.

00;06;36;10 - 00;06;48;09

Stephan Combs

Oh yeah I mean it's very easy to look at a contract and say, wow, this is funding 90% toward stop loss in administration, 10% towards claims. It doesn't take a mathematician know that's probably not going to work out long term.

00;06;48;11 - 00;07;01;08

Cary Hall

Yeah, it's probably not going to work out long term. But again, you know, that's the responsibility of the broker. Absolutely. To do that and present to the employer and to do what they need to do. And unfortunately, that just always happen.

00;07;01;10 - 00;07;09;03

Stephan Combs

Oh, absolutely. I mean, most of the plans being sold today, level funded are funded underneath that arrangement. So it happens a lot.

00;07;09;05 - 00;07;22;05

Cary Hall

Yeah it does. And the unfortunate part of it is the blowback comes to the employer, who then has to go back to his employees and change of plans and do this or do that, or to adjust the the overall cost. And it really doesn't work out. So we're going to come back to the break here in a few minutes.

00;07;22;05 - 00;07;40;28

Cary Hall

We're going to continue this conversation. We'll talk with Marc about some of the things that they're doing out there to attract brokers into their program and how you as an employer, if you're not happy, what can you do to change that? Well, we'll talk about all of that. We'll be right back after the break. The website is BrokersBloc.com BrokersBloc.com.

00;07;40;28 - 00;07;59;10

Cary Hall

I was just up to this morning. They've changed it again adding some things to it. It's a great website with a ton of information. You're an HR director, your broker A you're an employer. You might want to take a look that it could make a difference. Stay tuned. We'll be right back after the break. You're listening to America's Healthcare Advocate broadcasting coast to coast across USA.

00;07;59;11 - 00;08;10;21

Cary Hall

Stay right there.

00;08;10;23 - 00;08;31;10

Cary Hall

Welcome back. You're listening to America's Healthcare Advocate show. Broadcasting. Coast to coast to coast, USA on all of our stations across the country. I want to give a little shout out to WBAC 1340 in Dalton, Georgia. And with us for quite a while. Great people down there. We're very happy to be on the air and had them as part of America's Healthcare Advocate family.

00;08;31;10 - 00;08;44;22

Cary Hall

Once again, as I said, all these shows are up on our podcast platform. So if you want to tell somebody about this, maybe you're a human resource director and you guys are not happy with your broker. You want to go to the boss and say, you know, we need to make a change. These people can help you do that.

00;08;44;23 - 00;09;06;12

Cary Hall

They're the people from BrokersBloc. The website is BrokersBloc.com in studio A Stephen Combs and Marc Wiersma. They are here from BrokersBloc to talk about what they're doing and how they're doing it. So Marc, let's just talk about you're kind of new on board here, but your background, what you're doing and how you're allowing some of these brokers to do a better job of what they should be doing.

00;09;06;14 - 00;09;06;21

Cary Hall

Yeah.

00;09;06;27 - 00;09;15;21

Marc Wiersma

Thanks, Kerry. Yeah. Appreciate the opportunity. Yeah. So I worked I've worked for about 35 years in the employee benefits space, and I've always worked for giant insurance companies.

00;09;15;23 - 00;09;18;17

Cary Hall

So it's unfortunate.

00;09;18;20 - 00;09;42;04

Marc Wiersma

Well, yeah. In retrospect, no, it's actually been great experience to get the training, to get the knowledge and relationships in the marketplace. So, I met Stephen, about 6 or 7 months ago, and he explained to me what BrokersBloc was about, and it really lined up with what I'm passionate about. So I really have a lot of, compassion for brokers and for groups in the small group space.

00;09;42;06 - 00;10;01;19

Marc Wiersma

It's been an undervalued, under-served space for as long as I've been in the business. And so I wanted to bring my experience and knowledge to brokers to help them become more efficient, to bring better value to their clients and to kind of demystify the space right to to help them understand that it's not that scary.

00;10;01;22 - 00;10;18;06

Cary Hall

To go so far, really scary for the employer to reach. Trying to make it be. Yeah, it's going to affect you've got 50 employees, maybe you've only got ten employees. But the point is, if they don't understand, as we talked about in the last block, knowledge is power they don't have. That's the responsibility of the broker. Marc.

00;10;18;09 - 00;10;46;00

Marc Wiersma

Yeah, absolutely. And so these groups are every bit as important as our largest groups in terms of our employment population as far as incomes and, you know, livelihood, all of these things we need to take care of our small group employers. So, that's really why I jumped into BrokersBloc was to bring that consultative, experience that I have and help them navigate this kind of scary world of level funding.

00;10;46;02 - 00;11;10;16

Marc Wiersma

Right. There's, solutions out there. Nobody's ever heard of before. We're bringing those solutions, but then helping brokers explain those to their clients, we're helping to, make sure they don't step into the the holes that you can step into. As Steven mentioned this earlier, you know, we've kind of learned quite a bit about the space that we can share, through BrokersBloc.

00;11;10;22 - 00;11;34;14

Cary Hall

You know, it's funny because I look back, I've been doing this for 27 years. Not quite as long as, you know, I came a little later to game, but I remember when Level Premium first came out and there was one particular carrier who I will not bother to name, who, came in with these remarkable prices. And we wrote we had some groups up in Minnesota, we had some groups of the places, and we wrote the policies, and the first year kind of went okay.

00;11;34;14 - 00;11;56;04

Cary Hall

The second year, we started seeing increases of 70%, 100%, all the rest of it. And then it dawned, because this is right when this first started, years ago, it dawned on me that, okay, this is what's going on here. They're coming in a low balling this in the first year or two years. And then the minute the claims hit, they'll renew you because they couldn't say they're not going to renew you.

00;11;56;04 - 00;12;15;21

Cary Hall

They renew you. They just push the premium up 700% or 770% or 100%. And then obviously the broker had to run. And that happened to us 3 or 4 times. And I'm, you know, at that point I'm like, we're done with these guys. Yeah, okay. Because it was a game dove. You know, you and you learn to express.

00;12;15;21 - 00;12;37;16

Cary Hall

But you know when when you see that kind of thing, that behavior, then it's incumbent upon you as the broker. And I assume you guys, you know, part of what Steven and all of you are doing, right. And everybody else in the company is you're vetting these things before they become something that you're willing to put out there and promote on your platforms, to the broker to work with you.

00;12;37;18 - 00;13;11;12

Marc Wiersma

Right? Yeah. Buying business is not a long term strategy, right. It's going to come to roost. Right. So good example. The first account that I placed here in the Kansas City market, received proposals in, from our, our various carrier network. And we got one that looked really, really good, too good. Right. So I picked up the phone, I called the producer, who I've known for many years, and I said, hey, I've got a phenomenal offer for you, but I'm concerned, right when they come in that far below the renewal and they're an outlier, right?

00;13;11;12 - 00;13;34;22

Marc Wiersma

There weren't other bids that looked like it. And I said, let's, let's really look at this thing and decide what is the appropriate pricing for your client. And so we looked at it and we talked about it, and we went back to the carrier. And we negotiated a higher price than what they initially offered. It was still very competitive and very attractive for the client, but we actually built in some cost to it.

00;13;34;22 - 00;13;56;07

Marc Wiersma

But in the claims funding, not the fixed, because the fixed, the employer can never participate in that in their surplus. Correct. So it could run great. And the insurance carrier keeps all the money. So when we put money back into it, we put it into the claims funding so that if it does perform well the employer will get the benefit of that.

00;13;56;07 - 00;13;58;16

Cary Hall

And it also reduces the risk.

00;13;58;19 - 00;14;06;18

Marc Wiersma

It does it. So, you know, a level funded plan technically doesn't have immediate risk, right.

00;14;06;18 - 00;14;07;28

Cary Hall

Because it's technically.

00;14;08;00 - 00;14;17;04

Marc Wiersma

Right. Exactly. But the risk of taking a low rate and then having a huge increase the next time around, it really plays havoc with your budgeting if you're.

00;14;17;11 - 00;14;24;02

Cary Hall

Yeah, not only that. What is the employees? What do employees hate here? We're changing carriers next year.

00;14;24;02 - 00;14;25;13

Marc Wiersma

Exactly.

00;14;25;15 - 00;14;47;26

Cary Hall

And that comes from taking something like that at face value, not doing the deep dive to understand why does this look as good as it looks in comparison to everybody? What is it that these guys have got something and you're looking going well, actually nothing. It's the way they structured this thing so that they're we're back to that selling the selling price for benefit.

00;14;47;29 - 00;15;06;10

Cary Hall

And then that you just said, oh when the, when the chickens come home to roost. Right. And we get that 3747 57% increase. It's like you also if you're the broker in that situation, they're looking at you like, why did you sell me this? Well, why did you put me in this position?

00;15;06;10 - 00;15;07;02

Marc Wiersma

Oh yeah.

00;15;07;05 - 00;15;09;12

Cary Hall

Yeah. So I mean it's a lose lose for everybody.

00;15;09;18 - 00;15;20;03

Stephan Combs

Well a big issue. You run into it and that happens as well. Is any of those 56 tricks and increases a lot of carriers. Look at that and say something's going on in this group and then do it.

00;15;20;07 - 00;15;38;07

Cary Hall

And that yes is a huge issue. And so here's what we're going to do that that was a really interesting point Steven brought up. We're going to come back after the break, and we're going to talk about why that's like a black list. Okay. You know when you go to the next carrier, we'll talk about this when we come back and why you need to pay attention.

00;15;38;08 - 00;15;57;15

Cary Hall

That and why your broker needs to pay attention to it. And if they're not, they're not doing their job. So the website is BrokersBloc.com BrokersBloc.com. You know go up there. They've got a lot of information up there. You're you're the broker. If you're an employer or a human resource director, take a look at these guys and see what they can do.

00;15;57;18 - 00;16;18;02

Cary Hall

They're totally transparent. They actually, you know, do a lot of the work to help the brokers. They just heard Marc say they went out and they got all of the proposals, pulled them together, and then they came back to the broker and evaluated those. That is a much better way to do this, okay. Especially if you're the broker out there and you've got a lot of these small groups.

00;16;18;05 - 00;16;47;03

Cary Hall

This is a great way to do this is going to make a lot of sense to you. Once again, the website is brokersbloc.com. brokersbloc.com. Stay tuned. We'll be right back after the break. You're listening to America's Healthcare Advocate Broadcasting here on the HIA radio Network. Coast to coast Cross, USA. Don't go anywhere.

00;16;47;05 - 00;17;04;06

Cary Hall

Welcome back. You're listening to America's Healthcare Advocate show broadcasting coast to coast across USA here on the HIA radio Network. You know, you're listening to this. You're intrigued. You say, you know, maybe, maybe, maybe what we're doing is not all that in a bag of chips. We maybe had to go to the website, take a look at these people.

00;17;04;06 - 00;17;20;16

Cary Hall

They really know what they're doing. They're very good at. You're the broker out there. You're juggling 15, 20 groups. You're trying to do the renewals and everything else. Wouldn't it be nice to have a partner that can really do something to help you? That's BrokersBloc. They can make a big difference. And if you're the employer, you the human resource director, you're unhappy.

00;17;20;16 - 00;17;38;05

Cary Hall

You're looking for a solution. They can give you a list of brokers that they know they're working with. They're going to do what's supposed to be done the right way and not try to sell you something, because it's in their best interest to sell it. They're going to do something that makes sense for you and create a long term relationship.

00;17;38;05 - 00;17;58;24

Cary Hall

Their website is BrokersBloc.com BrokersBloc.com. So this was interesting. We you mentioned this. We went off the air. This used to happen constantly. You got a 15 life group totally life group 50 life group. They got a bad increase okay. We got to go shop. And what does he care. Well we need to see your claims data.

00;17;58;27 - 00;18;21;26

Cary Hall

What's your renewal rate? Well, we can't get the claim said. Well, what's your renewal? Oh, it's 37%. Red flag carrier goes. We don't want that group. This isn't an ACA, people. This is level problem level funded and self-funded. We don't want that group. The they've got they've got a bad claims history. Talk about that because that happens.

00;18;22;02 - 00;18;22;24

Cary Hall

00;18;22;26 - 00;18;42;25

Stephan Combs

That to me is the biggest risk of underfunding your claims bucket. And that's why you're almost better off increasing rates a little bit to give you a little bit of a buffer. Because what'll happen is all these carriers are going to see that you had a massive claims year and you had a huge real renewal because, you know, you ran high in your claims because they were underfunded and they're not even going to make you an offer.

00;18;42;25 - 00;18;49;27

Stephan Combs

They're just going to decline, to quote. So you might have gotten, you know, 7 or 8 quality offers, whereas now you're only getting 2 or 3.

00;18;49;27 - 00;18;51;13

Cary Hall

And they might not be quality. I don't think.

00;18;51;13 - 00;18;53;22

Stephan Combs

It's exactly, exactly at.

00;18;53;24 - 00;18;55;25

Cary Hall

Yeah. And so you're in a box.

00;18;55;25 - 00;18;56;09

Stephan Combs

Yes.

00;18;56;11 - 00;19;19;27

Cary Hall

And and it's a box that hard. That should have been anticipated. Okay. By the broker that brought put that plan in place. Now there are obviously there are situations where no one has control. Somebody has a medical event, a heart attack, a stroke or something along those lines that that that's something you cannot control. But you also have to understand what that means whenever it comes time for that.

00;19;20;03 - 00;19;37;18

Cary Hall

If that does happen, how do you tackle that? How do you deal with it? So what do you guys do in a situation like that? Somebody comes to you, broker comes to you, employer comes in and says, we just got whacked. Okay. And, we can't get anybody to talk to us. I mean, we got two carriers here, but their rates, their rates are going to be horrible.

00;19;37;21 - 00;19;47;28

Cary Hall

The benefits we're going to have to raise deductibles, raise copays, costs, shift to our employees. That's going to piss the employees off. You're going to have a big problem. How do you guys deal with a situation like this?

00;19;47;28 - 00;19;53;26

Stephan Combs

So the funny thing is, most brokers, when they first engage with us, it's because they're in that situation.

00;19;53;29 - 00;19;59;03

Cary Hall

Isn't that amazing? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Guess what? I'm in trouble. Mommy, mommy, come help me.

00;19;59;03 - 00;20;14;25

Stephan Combs

Well, yeah. Exactly. Yeah. So most brokers, I mean, they're not going to give you a shot on their their whole block or their best business, and they really shouldn't. You gotta test people out. And usually it's the challenging cases. And I will say you're not completely out of luck if you're in that scenario. It's about understanding what's going on.

00;20;14;25 - 00;20;33;23

Stephan Combs

You need to understand, okay, who are the claimants? Are they still there or are they still are the conditions still there? Was it a short claim? Where are the claims underfunded. If we can see the buckets, we have some data to make an argument to our carriers of. Sure they ran hot. Sure. They got a big increase. However, the claims were underfunded.

00;20;33;25 - 00;20;34;11

Stephan Combs

Numbers.

00;20;34;14 - 00;20;52;23

Cary Hall

Go back to what you just said. What if they're out? What if they're gone? Yeah. What if they went on Cobra and now they're on Cobra. They're paying the premium. The employer's not paying it anymore. The risk is being handled. So if they're off the plan yeah okay. So how much of a difference does that making in the carriers total?

00;20;52;24 - 00;20;56;16

Cary Hall

I mean the people that are going to bid the carriers are big. They don't know that.

00;20;56;19 - 00;21;00;27

Stephan Combs

Well, Cobra members sometimes are the ones screwing up the renewal.

00;21;00;27 - 00;21;02;03

Cary Hall

It very much so.

00;21;02;05 - 00;21;16;13

Stephan Combs

And there's some solutions out there. There's some vendors out there that obviously can't force members to jump off Cobra. But a lot of times, even though the ACA subsidies did, you know, change, there's still a lot of times in the ACA plans are more competitive. The rates are.

00;21;16;15 - 00;21;33;08

Cary Hall

Well, and here's the thing that employees don't get until the time that it happens. You go on Cobra, you're paying oh, my portion of the plan, I'm paying the employer's portion of the plan, and I'm paying another 1 or 2% on top of that. Yeah. So you're eating the whole enchilada, which is not what you signed up for.

00;21;33;12 - 00;21;52;13

Cary Hall

So really when that happens and you can you go back to that employer say, I want to talk to these people that are on Cobra and you show them, hey, you know, if you go on ACA, it's $500 month less than what you got right now, and it's a better plan or as good a plan and you're not going to lose anything.

00;21;52;16 - 00;22;00;10

Cary Hall

You've done them a service. You've done the employer service. Now connect the dots. You go back to the carrier, say they're off. Now what can we do exactly?

00;22;00;10 - 00;22;16;02

Stephan Combs

I mean, because think about the people taking Cobra is sure there's a handful that they just want a piece of mind have the concerns. But most people on Cobra, they're there. There's a reason why they're okay. Thing 102% of the premium 100% as because they're going to be high utilizar yeah.

00;22;16;04 - 00;22;35;23

Cary Hall

And they've even got an ongoing comorbidity issue. It's causing a huge problem. Yeah. Okay. Or they've got somebody their family with the same issue they have. They feel like they can't get off. Yeah I may be paying $1,200 a month for this or $2,000 a month, but I can't get off because the medical bills are going to be 200,000.

00;22;36;00 - 00;22;48;01

Cary Hall

But if they move over to ACA with no underwriting and get immediate coverage, boom, that all goes away. Now maybe they're only paying 607 hundred and 800 a month, and they've got as good or better than coverage.

00;22;48;01 - 00;23;03;22

Stephan Combs

Yep, exactly. Help people. There's still there's don't even think about it. They don't even realize that that's even an option. So it's not because they're trying to stay on the group plan because they maybe think it's better. Maybe they do think it's better, but if they can look at the other options, a lot of times they can get something a lot more competitive.

00;23;03;24 - 00;23;23;02

Cary Hall

Yeah. And that's really what, as Marc just talked about. That's what you guys are doing, is you're bringing them the whole picture. Yes. Because you have access to peaches. I mean, you're working now with, you know, some of the, some of the different networks, HP in the Blue Cross that work, talk about that a little bit because that again, that's an access and that's critical.

00;23;23;06 - 00;23;37;03

Stephan Combs

Yeah. So we added on a new carrier partner, the TPS Cloud Array Health. They have access to the Blue Cross High Performance network. Can get very aggressive on cost. It's a little bit more narrow than the the blue PPO, but it's still the blue Cross network and it's nationwide.

00;23;37;05 - 00;23;49;27

Cary Hall

You know, it can be a little bit more narrow, but if it still gives some access to great carriers, I mean, excuse me, great providers and great hospitals, they don't need the full PPO network. So that can make a huge difference. That's like an EPO buy, right?

00;23;50;03 - 00;24;05;02

Stephan Combs

It is. Now there are some providers in some markets that don't take it. So that's why we're always cautious whenever chopping a health plan. And we're making sure that all the necessary providers are in network. So we'll recommend it when it makes sense and we won't when it does.

00;24;05;04 - 00;24;22;16

Cary Hall

So even if they're not in the network, if there's an alternative provider inside that network, they can move to yes, that that could make that could make the difference. And it allows them it affects everybody in the plan and allows the cost to come down based on the fact you're doing something. It affects everybody in the plan.

00;24;22;19 - 00;24;36;00

Stephan Combs

Exactly. I mean, there are some markets where there's a provider that you just have to have, right? And in those scenarios it can be a knockout. But you're right. If there's multiple providers and you can make a switch, then yes, it could still make a lot of sense.

00;24;36;07 - 00;24;48;16

Cary Hall

Yeah. That's really kind of what you're trying to do is that to give them options that are going to make sense, maybe those are options to that broker doesn't know about that employer certainly doesn't know about. Yeah they could make a big difference for them.

00;24;48;19 - 00;24;58;18

Stephan Combs

Yeah. For the right in the right group. Absolutely. And speaking of networks, we have a lot of regional networks as well. I mean we have access to health Lincoln and Saint Louis and Illinois, very popular network over there.

00;24;58;19 - 00;25;06;04

Cary Hall

I used to use that actually, when I was actually when I was a broker and I used it in Illinois. That's really funny that you brought that up because it was it was a great network.

00;25;06;04 - 00;25;08;05

Stephan Combs

Yeah. When the networks like that all across the country.

00;25;08;08 - 00;25;19;24

Cary Hall

So again, you know, it's having access. They can make a difference. It can lower the cost but not lower the benefits to the to the folks that are actually on the plane, because that's the challenge that the broker faces.

00;25;20;00 - 00;25;38;04

Stephan Combs

Exactly what I like about those networks as well is, you know, they have their their tier one network, right? But then if you have employees outside of the state or let's say that you have kids in college, they have it a tier two network as well. Same benefits. Just if you're out of state. This is the network that they they gravitate towards.

00;25;38;06 - 00;25;44;18

Stephan Combs

And our carriers have first health. Some of them actually have BlueCross as their secondary network.

00;25;44;20 - 00;25;54;09

Cary Hall

That's remarkable. You don't see that very often. Yeah. It's yeah, that Blue Cross is kind of like the American Express Platinum card. Yeah. And it's at least that's how people view it. Marc.

00;25;54;09 - 00;25;56;03

Marc Wiersma

Oh, absolutely. Yeah. I mean.

00;25;56;07 - 00;26;09;29

Cary Hall

Are some really, you know, at as a really good carrier I'm not a big fan of United. I'm sorry. I never have been. But you know you look at Aetna Cigna and Blue Cross and Blue Cross is kind of like the list. Like I said it's the American Express Platinum card and it can make a big difference.

00;26;10;06 - 00;26;15;04

Stephan Combs

Oh yeah. Whenever I hear Blue Cross or your sparkly or TPA partner has access. Yeah. You get excited. Yeah.

00;26;15;04 - 00;26;36;05

Cary Hall

Let's just like to take a with our access to Blue Cross. It's a big difference. So the website, if you want to learn more BrokersBloc.com. BrokersBloc.com. There's a lot of information up there. And they really do can make a difference I mean you know we work with a lot of different brokers around the country and the folks that work with them, like John Kuhlmann and some of the other brokers they work with, these folks know what they're doing.

00;26;36;05 - 00;26;52;20

Cary Hall

It's a good place to take a look at what it is and how can it benefit you and how could benefit your clients. Again, the website BrokersBloc.com BrokersBloc.com. We'll be right back after the break. To wrap it up, we're going to talk a little bit about ancillary benefits. Now this is one that kind of gets away from people.

00;26;52;20 - 00;27;08;06

Cary Hall

Sometimes we're going to talk about how they do that and what they do and how they can make a difference. Stay tuned for coming back right after the break here on America's Healthcare Advocate.

00;27;08;08 - 00;27;28;06

Cary Hall

Welcome back. You're listening to America's Healthcare Advocates Show broadcasting coast to coast across USA here on the HIA radio Network. Once again, you're listening to this. You want to tell somebody about or share it with somebody in your company. Go to the podcast. Platforms are 16 of them. Apple. And a couple of the others now are actually allowing us to put video up.

00;27;28;06 - 00;27;47;14

Cary Hall

So not only do we have it on the YouTube channel, it's also on another of the podcast channels now. So the podcast channels are now adding video in some cases. So I think it's Spotify and Apple. They're allowing us to do it now. So again, all the shows are up there and this particular one, if the interest you can help you, this is a great place to go.

00;27;47;14 - 00;28;08;04

Cary Hall

Look at it in studio with me from BrokersBloc is Stephen Combs and Marc Wiersma. And we're talking about what they do, how they do it, how it affects employers and how it affects brokers, and how brokers can do a better job with their resources using these folks. So let's talk about ancillary, because this is one where it kind of gets away from people sometimes.

00;28;08;04 - 00;28;36;22

Cary Hall

And, and and unfortunately a lot of times, I think it, it's more driven by who could make the sale than it is by what is the real benefit. So let's just talk about that. What. That's a trap that sometimes employers fall into. And then they find out this really didn't work out like we thought was going to work out that we, you know, they bring in, you know, you know, a claim, you know, somebody goes on disability or whatever the case may be, and they move from temporary disability, permanent disability.

00;28;36;24 - 00;28;49;13

Cary Hall

And it's like, you've got to go submit a bid to the Pentagon before you can get the claims page. And I speak from experience, having to deal with that. And you know, that sometimes going in. So talk a little bit about that and how you help educate inform.

00;28;49;16 - 00;29;08;02

Stephan Combs

So when we start our BrokersBloc, we always wanted to be very strategic in what we do or don't do. And so we figured out from the beginning we want to be experts and medical level funded. So right now we don't do any ancillary business direct. However, what we do is we set up a partnership with GIS Benefits.

00;29;08;04 - 00;29;30;10

Stephan Combs

They're a national firm. They have access to all the carriers. They're absolute experts in the ancillary space and also enrollment space. Because the biggest thing when it comes to all of your benefits is education, right? You're making new changes. The employees need to understand what those changes are. And so they have rollers, they have enrollment technology, and they have all the carriers.

00;29;30;12 - 00;29;35;00

Stephan Combs

And the guidance for when things pop up like a disability claim to help with those.

00;29;35;02 - 00;29;59;28

Cary Hall

So talk about how that works. I mean, there's this whole array of, of, options you can pick up there. You've got dental, you got you got disability, you've got life insurance, which I always found interesting. You know, it's so, you know, sometimes for a dollar or $2 a month, the employer can put a 10,000, $20,000 life insurance policy on there.

00;29;59;28 - 00;30;17;22

Cary Hall

And the other part that I always found devastating was that the the employees could actually buy up to a bigger number. And it was always funny to me because, you know, who always bought the policies and bought up the women? Not the guys. You guys really. I don't know what it was, but they just can't get it to their head.

00;30;17;25 - 00;30;37;19

Cary Hall

But the women would always I could get this on my husband? Yeah. I'm going to get this. You know, not underwritten straight through. Okay. And then you can go up to certain level, talk a little bit about that and how that because that's, that's a piece like when I did it, you know, we had 14 clinics, Shawnee Health in in Marion, Illinois, and Carterville, Illinois.

00;30;37;20 - 00;30;55;07

Cary Hall

They ran all over rural Illinois. And I just remember doing that whole process and those nurses and, and nurses aides and all the rest, and they're like, oh, wow, we can sign up our husbands and our children. And they were all over it. So talk a little about that. Why that kind of stuff is really important for people.

00;30;55;14 - 00;31;13;16

Stephan Combs

And so a lot of brokers overlook ancillary completely. I mean, I even I've even had ancillary reps tell me from my broker days that they understand that ancillary conversation is one that happens in the elevator after a good medical meeting. They understand it. However, there's a lot of there are a lot of advisors don't really get that deep into it.

00;31;13;18 - 00;31;34;09

Stephan Combs

They kind of take what they're currently doing mirrored or match it, as opposed to, hey, if you're just offering dental, vision and basic life, voluntary life, worksite benefits. All of these are employee paid by employees. I mean, they really love the benefits and it makes them stake your employees and it cost you nothing as an employer. Yeah, I.

00;31;34;09 - 00;31;54;19

Cary Hall

Mean, I remember on the disability side, I would actually try to get them to do a short disability policy. Okay. And the primary reason especially is that group I just talked about, they were 80% women. We put that in place that had covered maternity leave. Oh my God. You know, you would have thought I walked on water when I put that in place.

00;31;54;19 - 00;32;06;12

Cary Hall

And nobody had even told them about this in the past, like, oh well, we added, they said they've got full coverage whether whether on leave while they're, you know, the whole nine yards made an enormous difference for these people.

00;32;06;14 - 00;32;23;01

Stephan Combs

Oh, exactly. And that's why it's super important to have and rollers for groups, especially if these are new benefits because you can add in disability policy, short term, long term worksite all day long. But if the employees do understand what they're looking at on their enrollment platform, they might not sign up for something that they could really have used.

00;32;23;03 - 00;32;47;08

Cary Hall

Yeah, but the other thing is when they see the how inexpensive this is, that I mean, the way I always looked at this was you and the way I presented it was, you've got a house payment on the car payment, okay. And whatever ancillary expenses you have on the side of that, okay. When your salary gets cut off because you're on maternity leave or you've got to reduce whatever it may be, and this policy could come in to make up the difference.

00;32;47;08 - 00;32;50;08

Cary Hall

Net. How much easier is that make your life.

00;32;50;10 - 00;32;59;25

Stephan Combs

Oh yeah. I mean it's it's it's incredible. I mean, I mean, there's probably more people who go bankrupt due to disability than, than death. So, I.

00;32;59;25 - 00;33;02;11

Cary Hall

Mean, that's interesting. I did not know that that's a, that's the.

00;33;02;13 - 00;33;06;25

Marc Wiersma

Highest, highest number of foreclosures in the United States are caused by long term disability.

00;33;06;28 - 00;33;25;23

Cary Hall

I could not know that. That's remarkable. But yeah, and it's such an easy thing to do. I mean, I actually this is funny because I actually have a client that we did years ago who is still on the disability policy. We wrote with the Guardian, still on. He's been on it for 15 years, and he's on it until he's 65.

00;33;25;28 - 00;33;26;28

Cary Hall

Yeah, yeah.

00;33;26;28 - 00;33;28;14

Stephan Combs

I mean, it's not expensive. Why why wouldn't.

00;33;28;14 - 00;33;34;19

Cary Hall

You know what it was for for them? But maybe he was in a horrible accident. Yeah, he's functioning, but he's not functioning at the level he did before.

00;33;34;21 - 00;33;36;01

Stephan Combs

Oh, he's still getting the benefit.

00;33;36;01 - 00;33;57;09

Cary Hall

He's still getting the benefits. 15 years later, he goes till he's 65. I remember when I wrote it, I had no idea. He was a contractor for the federal government in Afghanistan. And we, we put all of that in place had made a huge difference to who knew he was going to wind up in an accident at home on a bicycle after he survived two tours in Afghanistan.

00;33;57;11 - 00;34;01;11

Cary Hall

But he's made it. Their lives would have been a disaster if he hadn't gotten that money.

00;34;01;11 - 00;34;08;20

Stephan Combs

Oh absolutely. And you lose a paycheck for that long. I mean, how can you, you know, plan for retirement? How can you? I mean, you'd have to cut everything out.

00;34;08;25 - 00;34;25;25

Cary Hall

Yeah, there's none of that. None of that. None of that works. And so but that's your job, Marc, as the brokers to go and explain. Look, you know, you're sitting here today, everybody's healthy, happy, all the rest of it. If an event happens tomorrow, how are you going to pay the mortgage if you don't have any life insurance, how are you going to pay the mortgage?

00;34;25;25 - 00;34;43;21

Cary Hall

How are you going to put that kid to school? How are you going to put that kid through college? You know, whatever the case may be, that all goes out the window and so, you know, if you're if you're offering, you're saying to broke right here, here, here. So these people can do it all for you. All you have to do is go and sit down with him and let them help you make the presentation and lock it load.

00;34;43;21 - 00;34;45;21

Cary Hall

And then they come in and do all the work basically.

00;34;45;21 - 00;34;46;13

Stephan Combs

Exactly.

00;34;46;19 - 00;34;58;05

Cary Hall

Yeah. And that's really kind of the message that BrokersBloc is delivering. Is it across the board whether it's on the health side, the level benefits side or whatever the case may be, is that you guys are actually going in there and making a difference?

00;34;58;07 - 00;35;00;16

Stephan Combs

No, I absolutely.

00;35;00;18 - 00;35;04;23

Cary Hall

And that's the mission. And that's the mission. It's going to continue.

00;35;04;25 - 00;35;08;02

Stephan Combs

Oh yeah, for sure. We're just going to keep on adding more products, more stuff to our.

00;35;08;03 - 00;35;17;08

Cary Hall

Yeah. And adding more. And more carriers and more networks, all the rest of it. And it's going to work out really well. It's BrokersBloc. The website is BrokersBloc.com. Thank you guys for coming in here.

00;35;17;08 - 00;35;18;11

Stephan Combs

Thank you for having us. Yeah.

00;35;18;15 - 00;35;34;28

Cary Hall

Well I think we're delivering a lot of good information today. And that's really what this is all about. Once again the website BrokersBloc.com. BrokersBloc.com. If you want information go up there they'll be happy to chat with you. They're really good at what they do and they can make a big difference if you're the broker or you're the employer.

00;35;35;01 - 00;35;52;20

Cary Hall

And now I leave you with this thought from Albert Einstein, the one who follows the crowd. Will usually get no further than the crowd. The one who walks alone will likely find himself in places no one has ever been. Remember, friends, it's a funny thing about life. If you refuse to accept anything but the very best, you most often get it.

00;35;52;22 - 00;36;05;25

Cary Hall

Thank you for listening to America's Healthcare Advocates Show Broadcasting Coast to coast across the USA here on the HIA radio Network. Goodbye America.

00;36;05;28 - 00;36;12;03

Cary Hall